How to Make Change at Work and in Your Community with Donna Wang Su ’14 MA

HELEN KIM: Welcome to Northwestern Intersections, where we talk to alumni about how key experiences have propelled them to their life's work. I'm Helen Kim for the Northwestern Alumni Association. And today we'll hear from Donna Wang Su, associate director at the Farley Center for Entrepreneurship and Innovation, who has two decades of experience in finance, strategic planning and higher education administration, where she has spent nearly 15 years at Northwestern.

Whether it's in the professional work setting or within the community as a mentor, committee member, or as a newly elected district 65 school board member of Evanston and Skokie, Donna's a constant learner and a motivated organizer. While we're celebrating the month of APIDA heritage in May. Today's episode will also touch on personal experiences of anti-Asian hate crimes and descriptions of Violence.

All right folks. Today we have Donna Wang Su on our show. Welcome Donna. How are you doing?

DONNA WANG SU: I think my phrase that I've been using during the pandemic is managing. I'm managing. How are you?

HELEN KIM: That's a great word. I think I'm also managing as well. The month of May is APIDA Heritage Month. So, exciting month. And does your family usually celebrate in a certain way or do you guys plan on celebrating in a way this year?

DONNA WANG SU: Well it's funny that you ask. I and another APIDA parent at my third graders elementary school. We wanted to put together a series of presentations in each of the classrooms. And they did this for February for Black History Month. And so we have invited, and I think currently we have over 20 different community members that are APIDA descent that will be coming to talk to each of the different classrooms.

And we said that it's up to them. They can do like a workshop, maybe show a skill, teach something, or they can read a story or just do like a Q&A. And so that's something I'm really excited about. And then I'm also sitting on a panel for another elementary school. And then I think with the TEACH Act, the fact that now it has to go through the Senate, it's pretty exciting. Which baffles me and surprises me is how Illinois would be the first state to make it a requirement to have APIDA history taught in the elementary and middle school level.

HELEN KIM: Yeah.

DONNA WANG SU: That is not part of the curriculum.

HELEN KIM: Yeah, just hope that there's more and more kids that are more exposed to it. And even at Northwestern I know the Asian-American studies program has been around not for too long, I think. For only a couple of decades, I believe.

DONNA WANG SU: I believe It started right before I started. And that came out of a hunger strike.

HELEN KIM: Yeah, I remember that. Well let's talk about you, Donna. I know you've been with the University for many years now. Is it about 15?

DONNA WANG SU: It'll be 15 this summer, so yes.

HELEN KIM: Oh my gosh. I remember the first time I heard your name was actually when I was at Bienen School of Music. And I remember literally every grad student I met and talked to their like, Donna is amazing. She is the one to go to. She is the one who has got everything under control. That's literally how I knew you and I was like secretly fan girling over you. But I was like, I don't think I'm just going to go up and say hello. But that's how I knew about you, because you were so loved by so many students at Bienen.

DONNA WANG SU: I would say the same would go for Bienen with Dean Jacobs.

HELEN KIM: Yes. For undergrad, yes.

DONNA WANG SU: Yeah there was, I think the fact that the school was so small and anyone that worked in the student affairs, you weren't just student affairs, you were everything, from part of recruitment to orientation, like that first welcome. And then we handled your finances, your academics, your classes. And then, of course, that student support. And then even all the way up to graduation. Being able to hand you your diploma and after. So I think because of that kind of support circle, it was just so valuable. Especially with music students, just because you do have that applied lesson teacher that you see every single week for all four years of your undergrad or two years for your master's. It's a different dynamic.

HELEN KIM: So, you've been at Northwestern for almost 15 years. Tell us about your Northwestern experience and history.

DONNA WANG SU: So I started at Northwestern in 2006. I was the assistant director at the student loan office. Accounting and loan originations. It was very finance related, and the best way I can describe it to people it was like a mini bank on campus that dealt with student lending. While I was there, I ended up picking up a business certificate. It was exciting in the sense that we were also upgrading one of our systems and I got to manage and be part of that user interface process, where we went from just really old school black screen and the little green cursor that blinked at you and you couldn't even click with your mouse. You had to physically tab over on the keyboard to get to a field.

So that was a tremendous experience where I think it really took me outside of my little bubble of a department and was able to interact with other departments, whether it was IT or all of the different systems that interface with. And then that had me actually checking out ANUW, which is Association of Northwestern University Women. And I wish that I checked it out earlier. I think it took me about three or four years before I joined it. And I realized it was so much more of Northwestern than my little department. I ended up leaving the student loan office to go to Medill, where I was an assistant director for graduate admissions and financial aid, which was another really wonderful experience Medill students and faculty and staff. They're just great.

What really opened my eyes even further was being part of a school that had a Chicago campus. And then there was a DC campus. And then there was the global program. And then this was before they opened up the San Francisco campus. So it was truly an all encompassing space. While I was there, I had the unfortunate loss of one of my students who committed suicide. And so because of that, that led me to attend a QPR, which is like a suicide awareness training. And I think for me, that was something that I not only have taken with me, but continue to refresh, just because it's so important with mental health. and I think as an APIDA woman, there's that cultural stigma around mental health.

And with that, I was former colleagues with the assistant dean at Bienen, Ryan O'Mealey. And he reached out to me saying that they were looking to change their graduate services program. They were taking several different positions and they were trying to create this hybrid counselor. And the idea was exciting. I like to start new things. So I went over there and really at Bienen I was able to shape, mold the graduate student's program and experience there.

While I was there, I realized that every school is so different between Medill and Bienen and Kellogg just Weinberg. Everything was different from the systems that they advise students out of, to the different programs that they used, that students used, that I ended up being part of a steering committee that founded this group called GPAN. And it stood for Graduate Professionals in Association at Northwestern. And really we met twice a quarter. One time we would have different parts of the University that would come and present to this group, and the other time was just a round table. And we were all professionals trying to support grad students, and trying to find common ground, and we didn't want to reinvent the wheel. We wanted to be able to better support each other.

From there, I ended up doing my master's in public policy administration part time while working full time. And I also became an advisor for several student groups, including one for mental health for artists that has a very special place in my heart. And then also Bienen, like I said, I did a lot of things. But one thing I started doing was providing additional workshops for students, because that's what they wanted. So we also did the QPR, but we also did different financial and budgeting workshops and interview. Just a variety of different things to really support students in the next step.

When I was at Bienen I also joined the change makers cohort, which led me to being a part of the listening to Black students' academic advisors, and then through that I kind of got the bug to go back to school again and part time, then I pursued the Higher Education Administration certificate through SESP. And about two years ago, 2 and 1/2 years ago the Farley Center for Entrepreneurship and Innovation, they were looking for an associate director to manage their operations. And I was approached. Kind of jumped at it. It was an amazing opportunity, I think, to not just service one school, but service the entire University, because Farley classes are open to any student at Northwestern.

And I would say from there I was bit by the bug again with more fellow colleagues, fellow APIDA colleagues To create the steering committee for ASAG, which is APIDA Staff Affinity Group. So it's been really tremendous to see how big ASAG has gotten, from our first little meeting to I'm trying to think, getting bubble tea. There is this one big meeting we had at Kellogg where for the first time, I wasn't just a minority in the room, either being female or being Asian. Which was just so rewarding and so validating. I'll never forget someone said, this is the most Asians that she has ever seen during her time at Northwestern. I could go on but I won't bore you.

HELEN KIM: No, I think it's so remarkable that you've shared so much about your journey from the beginning. And there's no end yet. I mean, you're still here, and it's still going, but to think that there's so much more behind those stories. And we could go on and on listening to your story. But I remember that time when we went to Kellogg and had that event with ASAG. And it just meant so much to be the majority in the room. And I just felt like myself. I felt like I could take off the mask that I feel like I have to carry on and put on a lot of times, where I am the minority. But I remember that was a pretty eye opening event.

DONNA WANG SU: Yeah. And it was tremendous for me. It was also at the same time I was in Change Makers. Where I remember someone telling me, Oh, you shouldn't wear your hair down because it makes you look even younger than you already look, where you look like a student. And so for years, I kept my hair up. And I remember just thinking, wow I could literally just let my hair down. I could be me. It didn't matter if I looked like I was in my 20s when I was really closer to 40. I could just be accepted for who I am. Not have to worry about someone asking me is Su part of my first name or is it my last name. Just questions like that

HELEN KIM: Yeah and it sounds like you really like being in new environments, going straight into new challenges. But was there ever any hesitancy about going to a new department or trying a completely new role that you never exactly had the same experience in before?

DONNA WANG SU: I would say, of course. I always will weigh my risks and rewards. And always nervous to step into a new space, because you don't know what that culture is like. What the expectations are and/or the standards that have been set before me. And I can't help but think, I think especially as a parent sometimes I keep thinking, am I going to let that fear stop me from trying something out.

Maybe if I look at a job description and they have like 10 preferred requirements and I only meet like seven or eight. Am I going to sell myself short and not go for it? I think that's actually one of the best advice I've ever gotten. Partially, when working on my final paper for my master's degree, it was, Donna, it just needs to be done, not perfect. Otherwise you're never going to be done. And it just makes me think, OK, well there is going to be no perfect situation, no perfect job there. You're just going to have to mold it into the best fit for you.

HELEN KIM: I love that. Making it work for you and following that path and whatever that path may look like. What is something that you learned while you were at Northwestern that has been most useful to you, in life or at work?

DONNA WANG SU: I think I've been very appreciative of the various mentors, women mentors here at my time at Northwestern. Whether it was Coleen Burrus, who's no longer here. She's over at Yale. Julie Collins at Medill, I think, for me, having a woman of color as a mentor not only did she teach me so much of what I financial advice and admissions, but it was just being able to navigate my space, the University, being a woman of color too.

Same thing. One of my faculty members telling me it just needs to get done, not perfect. And I've kind of taken that, especially with any kind of event planning. Things are just going to happen, and afterwards it's better. And it's important to go over what went well. You need those wins. And then what could have been better and what can be avoided and fixed for next time.

But kind of going in that order, you want to maintain the quality and things can always be changed and adjusted for next time. And I use this in my finance class that I taught. But I always talk about [INAUDIBLE]. I guess it can be reflective in life. I always tell them stay FUULL, so that stands for Follow Up, Update, Live, and Learn. So just keep going and stay FUULL.

HELEN KIM: Donna, you are a woman of advocacy and justice and you have your hands full in a lot of DIY work in your community and just in your personal life. How has your identity as an Asian-American woman shaped you to be who you are today?

DONNA WANG SU: So for me, I was born in Evanston and then raised in the West first. So I grew up very much a minority. I'm just thinking in my school K through eight, my sister and I were the only Chinese people in the entire school. I think it wasn't until I moved to California that I even met other Asian-Americans of Korean descent or Vietnamese or Thai. It was all so new to me. I didn't even realize what a popular last name Kim is until I moved out there. What was interesting to me was growing up I was never quote unquote, American enough. And then when I moved to Southern California suddenly I wasn't Asian enough, because I wasn't as in touch with my culture. And I think in college I really found my footing there.

I was part of the charter class for Alpha Kappa Delta Phi, which is the largest Asian interest sorority in both the US and Canada. And just realizing how much it meant to empower and support one another, especially women, instead of viewing each other as competition, we rise by supporting others. And I don't know if the social justice impact came naturally. I think that that's something that I have had to overcome my own biases, my own racism and having to unpack all that before I could be a better ally.

HELEN KIM: This month we're celebrating the plethora of contributions that Asians and Asian-Americans have made globally. And we're also grieving over the anti-Asian violence that's been taking place. This past year has just been especially painful and frankly, to be honest, just so infuriating. To the point where sometimes I don't know how to process. And I don't know how to grieve.

DONNA WANG SU: It's just a lot of shock. Unfortunately my family, especially my nine-year-old daughter, she's been I would say the target of over half of the incidents that I've reported on these Asian hate website. They've ranged from this was pre-pandemic. She was wearing a mask, and this was last February. We were in the grocery store. She was wearing a mask because she was sick, and I went to a grocery store just to get something for her.

And someone immediately started calling her a dirty chink, and to get away. And I froze and I panicked and I wanted just to kick her out of the situation. In retrospect, I was like maybe I should have stood up to her. But I don't know. I don't know how all of that. I know that even within our neighborhood, there was an adult male who decided to follow my sixth grader in their car. Slowly rolled down the window started yelling the F word and slurs at him, and freaked him out. He had to rush home.

But I'll never forget that. When he came home, he told me, you know what, Mom? That was the first time that I was scared. And I was targeted because of what I look like. Some of the other microaggressions. Oh you speak English so well. Kennedy, that's your American name, right? What's your other name? Or what are you, what are you from? But he was just like, this was the first time I was actually afraid. And then he paused, he said, I think this is how my black friends have felt. Even if we're not in a pandemic. And I think that really hit home a lot.

HELEN KIM: No one should be hearing that. That is not acceptable for anyone, but let alone kids to hear that on the street in the public.

DONNA WANG SU: So for him, he was 11 then. And then for my daughter, She was eight when that incident happened. and what's so hard is that kids are learning. So, during my daughter's ZOom school, she had other eight and nine-year-olds say something like, oh yeah, don't eat Chinese food that'll get you sick. Or they'll make comments to her saying like, when are you going back home. Just different things like that. And she's like, what are you talking about? I am home.

They're like, oh no, going back to China. And she's like, I'm not from China. So there's just a lot. I'm just thinking of the incident that scared me physically when I was just in the parking a Walgreens, just trying to grab stuff and someone threw a drink at me and yelled at me to go back to China. And I kept thinking like, what if it wasn't a drink? What if it was a brick? What if it was something else? And I remember, there was a good point where when I left the house I would wear glasses and a mask and a hat. Almost trying to hide my Asianness. But also accepting that I had the luxury and the privilege to be able to try and hide that.

HELEN KIM: How have you as a parent have been processing this? Especially with your kids and for your kids, and also for yourself.

DONNA WANG SU: As I mentioned, mental health is very important. Yeah, the challenges with parenting. I'm so grateful for the therapist that we have in our life and the luxury of being able to afford it and having the insurance to cover it. But also the social workers in my kids' school. I will say with my 12-year-old I was actually really jealous of him, because his social worker is a second generation Asian-American man.

And the fact that knowing that he doesn't need to go more into detail and explain cultural expectations or differences. I was kind of jealous of that. Someone just got him and understood why he might be nervous about speaking in another language or how he presents himself. It really takes a village, and I'm grateful for the community that we've been in that have helped both us through this time, but also this past year, we've just seen so much hate. Whether it's with Black Lives being murdered or the Asian hate. And the Atlanta murders or even the riots in the capital. There's just been so much turmoil and violence. It's so much more important to have our community come together.

HELEN KIM: Yeah, absolutely. And speaking of community, if there's one other thing to celebrate this month, you have been just elected as one of district 65's board member.

DONNA WANG SU: Yes, thank you.

HELEN KIM: Yes, congratulations. And how long did that process take? And walk us through why you wanted to join the board.

DONNA WANG SU: I've been part of my children's schools for the past 10 years. Whether it was a room parent or in fund raising. And, for me when about four years ago, I joined the PTA council, and I realized just how much I enjoyed it. I took community to the next level. PTA council is an umbrella organization that meets regularly and every single D 65 PTA sends a representative, or they try to. And whether we talk about different issues that we face, How can we collaborate together, what can we do both as individual schools, but also what can we do just overall.

And I think for me, I served as treasurer and Vice President and I'm currently the president for PTA council. I also saw the evolving of the PEP. PTA Equity Project. Which when they first started, I think the example we use is when you looked at the schools, and how much they fund-raise per student on the lower end, you might have only like $47 per student that you're able to fund-raise as a community. And then on the high end you had something like, 247.

And, by the way I don't remember the numbers exactly, so don't quote me. That's a huge difference. And so, one of the things that PEP wanted to do was overcome that inequity. And so, just last year they voted to create one fund, one pot. And then, that way, that can be distributed to students. So we can elevate those that don't have as much money and give them similar opportunities. But knowing that it's going to cost more to get them to the similar levels too.

And then running for school board, we have a new superintendent Dr. Devon Horton that started during a pandemic. But I really appreciated what he brought into our district when we were looking. And one of the things, and I have to go back and look at it, but he talked about this miracles framework. And it's an acronym and I love acronyms. And I kept thinking, what other ways can I impact and support our community. And I love the idea that school board, it wasn't just one V one. You and me, one of us is going to win, that's it. It was seven team members that come together, that volunteer their time. And with that, we can bring our strengths, and we can best support our community, our school district. And especially in guiding our new superintendent. So that was my reason for wanting to run. It just felt like a natural next step and another way of me impacting the community in representation.

So in December I had to collect at least 50 signatures from registered voters here in Evanston/Skokie. Just to be on the safe side, I collected 150. And I'm grateful for some friends that volunteered to help go around and collect that, because then we had to get that all notarized, and in a pandemic, nonetheless. And then after that, there's various paperwork that you end up filling, and then there's this one week that you go in to file in person.

We go downtown to the Cook County's office in downtown Chicago. And it's crazy, because there's just so many little rules. You have to staple it exactly in this one location, can't be paper clipped because then people can challenge it. And we saw in Evanston during the election process, someone had their entire application thrown out, because they used a paper clip instead of a staple. So lots of little things that I never knew before.

And then based on when you went and turned in your paperwork, That's how you showed up on the ballot. And then, I would say, from January to April it was just nonstop interviews, campaigning, fundraising, lots of talking to not just parents and families of 65, but also just residents in general. For property taxes the schools make up 67% of property taxes. So right now, the school, the district is in a deficit. And so, there's a lot of concern with people who are, oh, you guys are in a deficit. Are you going to raise our property taxes to cover this deficit? Or is there going to be work done to try to balance things out?

And election was April 6. And I never thought about how much local elections mattered. And I would say just that night, when they were counting up the numbers. When they closed out all of the Evanston precincts, I was actually losing by something like 15. And then when they included the Skokie precincts, I was then up I don't even remember the numbers anymore. They just fluctuated. I think at one point, someone told me I was only up by eight or nine votes. And what was nice with the school board, it was the top four candidates were selected. So the fourth and fifth candidate, myself and Marquis Weatherspoon, we were just really, really close. Quite the process.

HELEN KIM: Quite the process. And your dedication just shines through your story, and just everything you've done and will be doing for the community.

DONNA WANG SU: Thank you. I believe that if you're going to be part of a community, If you're going to complain about changes in the direction of things, you should do something about it. I always say that well done is better than well said. And so, I always tell my kids you can say something and can sound really pretty and very eloquent but make up for it. Same thing when they apologize, I'm like well, if you're really sorry, you're going to change the way that you act

HELEN KIM: Yeah. Donna your career path was not linear at all. You started from the finance world, moved on to a lot of admissions, got your master's in public policy, now doing operations, and your involvement with the community is just remarkable. How do you think your career is going to develop over time? And how do you foresee that in the future? What do you hope to see?

DONNA WANG SU: I would say the common thread through all of my positions has been my finance thread. So my first job out of college was actually working finance at a sports agency before then moving into the higher ed sphere. There's just great joy that I take out of balancing a budget or forecasting playing with numbers in a spreadsheet. But I think that sometimes just as life, it's never just a straight path that takes us in different directions.

And same thing, you just follow up, update live, learn, and keep going with it. I think what I see maybe in my career. Continued direction with operations. And operations really can be so many things. Finance, facilities, technology, overall support, administration. And I've learned that, for me, also working with people is so important, too. So kind of that recruitment and retention process. I think that as long as I can have access to my spreadsheets and I'm working with people, I'll be happy in what I choose to do.

But overall, I want to feel that there's an impact of what I'm doing. And I'll say it feels just like being at Medill. It's like, I will do all of this behind the scenes work to really make the jobs of others easier. Especially, I just keep thinking of Bienen and these amazingly talented musicians. If I can make their jobs easier, so then they can truly focus on their talent, their skills. This is my talent, my skills that brings me just so much validation. And fulfillment

HELEN KIM: Yeah, just embracing your talent and gift that you were given. Donna, as we come to a close, you just, just thank you for sharing the beginning of your career path and your Northwestern experience and all the things that you're doing for the community in Evanston and Skokie. I can't wait to hear what more you will do as a board member. So very excited to see that. But before we close, do you have any career advice that you would like to share with the Northwestern Network?

DONNA WANG SU: And this is the same advice I gave to a group of several hundred APIDA college women at a sorority convention. Stress is everywhere. You're going to deal with stress all throughout your life, whether it's personal or professional. And I guess this is more relevant for women, but check your BRA when you deal with stress. And the BRA, once again, it's an acronym. It's going to stand for Breath, take some breaths, calm yourself, Reflect, and then Action. Because you need that chance just to catch yourself, think in different directions before you act. So, and stay FUULL. Follow UP, Update, Live and Learn.

HELEN KIM: Thank you for tuning in to today's episode of Northwestern Intersections. For more information about our podcasts please visit northwestern.edu/intersections. Until next time, stay safe and take care of yourself and your families.